Tridandisvami Sri
Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Gosvami Maharaja
Darsan for ISKCON Gurukula Alumni
January 15, 2010
During Srila
Narayana Gosvami Maharaja’s week-long Hari-katha festival in Sao Paulo,
Brazil, one day just after his morning walk, he gave his audience to about
twenty Gurukula alumni, and other devotees as well. The following is a
transcription of that darsan:]
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] Where is Prema-prayojana?
Prema-prayojana, how are you?
[Prema-prayojana dasa (formally a sannyasa disciple of Srila Narayana
Gosvami Maharaja named Aranya Maharaja):] Okay, Gurudeva, by your grace I
could come here.
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] Your wife has divorced you?
[Prema-prayojana dasa:] No.
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] I want that she should divorce or you
should divorce. I have not left my hope that you will again return back.
[Prema-prayojana dasa:] By your grace, at the last moment before the
festival I got the ticket.
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] That is okay, but I want divorce.
Either you or she should divorce. *
[Prema-prayojana dasa:] But in many lectures you told everyone, “No
divorce.”
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] Last night after your class, I remarked
something. Did you understand?
[Prema-prayojana dasa:] Yes. “Apane na kaile dharma sikhana na yaya, ei
ta’ siddhanta gita-bhagavate gaya.” [“Unless one practices devotional
service himself, he cannot teach it to others. This conclusion is indeed
confirmed throughout the Gita and Bhagavatam.” (Sri Caitanya-caritamrta,
Adi-lila 3.22]
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] Don’t lose your life. Be totally
towards me. Why, I don’t know – being such a learned scholar, knowing
everything; and still you fell in the dark well. We have given you a rope.
Please hold on to it.
[Sripad Madhava Maharaja:] Now the gurukulis can ask their questions.
[Brajanath dasa:] Let them come forward.
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] Have the ISKCON leaders told you that
if you go to see Narayana Maharaja, then don’t return to ISKCON?
[Devotee:] No, Srila Maharaja, they have not said this.
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] Are you attending my classes?
[Devotee:] Yes.
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] Yes, you should attend. ISKCON cannot
give you what we are giving.
[Devotee (initiated by Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja):] Gurudeva, I have
a question. We are supposed to always respect our parents in every way. I
would like to know what kind of attitude we should have if our parents are
not favorable, or even committing offenses, towards you lotus feet.
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] Do you know Prahlada Maharaja? He
remained very tolerant, even though his father tried to kill him. At least
your father is not saying that he will kill you. It is better to wait and
tolerate their behavior, but don’t be derailed. Be very strong like
Prahlada Maharaja – more so than Prahlada. Of course you cannot be more
tolerant than he was; yet try.
What do the ISKCON Gurukulis want to say?
[Devotee:] Srila Gurudeva, many of us boys and girls were born and raised
on a farm close to here. We went to Gurukula there, and lived there during
our childhood. Today the place is very disgraced, as so many devotees who
have lived there for many years have no taste in bhakti and are offensive
to you.
Within our hearts we like that place. Whenever we return there from
another place, we feel as if we are going back home. Is there anything we
can do to change the attitude of those devotees? Is it right to do
anything to change them?
[Prema-prayojana dasa:] To affect the community there?
[Devotee:] Yes.
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] Four books have been published about my
relationship with my siska-guru, Srila A.C. Bhaktivedanta Svami Maharaja (Their
Lasting Relation, My Siksa-guru, Priya-bandhu, and Our Gurus – One in
Siddhanta, One at Heart), as well as a book of his letters to me (Letters
From America). You should try to read them.
[Prema-prayojana dasa:] When those who are against Gurudeva read these
books and understand his relationship with Srila Prabhupada, they may
change.
[Sripad Madhava Maharaja:] And Srila Bhaktivedanta Svami Maharaja wrote
the letters in his own handwriting, and in those letters he told about
their relationship. *
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] In truth, they do not have the respect
for Srila Bhaktivedanta Svami Maharaja that I have. They cannot properly
glorify him as I do. They know practically nothing of his real glory. They
cannot even explain the definition of bhakti. Can you explain it? You have
been there for so many years. I know you don’t know it.
If you want money, then be in ISKCON, and if you want bhakti, then
strictly come to me. I will give you bhakti.
There is one thing more I want to say. About a month and a half ago, a
delegation of the ISKCON GBC members – Sripad Gopal Krsna Maharaja, Sripad
Lokanatha Maharaja, Sriman Bhadri-narayana dasa, Sriman Ravindra-svarupa
dasa, and Sriman Anuttama dasa – came to me (in Govardhana) and said, “We
have done so many wrong things. Please excuse us, please excuse us, please
excuse us. We want to have the same relationship with you that we had
before.”
I told them, “I am very happy to hear this. I am ready. I would like to be
able to enter your mathas (temples) and speak hari-katha, and you should
come to my classes in my mathas and attend my festivals everywhere. We
should be together in that way.
I said, “You know that your Gurudeva took sannyasa in Sri Kesavaji Gaudiya
Matha. I am witness to this. At the time of his sannyasa ceremony, I
taught him how to wear his sannyasa cloth, I prepared his danda, and I
assisted him in all other ways. I have had a relationship with him since
1946.”
You should know that almost ninety percent of the sannyasis of ISKCON have
entered grhastha life, and many even went against ISKCON and took a lot of
money. On the other hand, it is very rare for my sannyasis to fall down –
only a few have fallen. He is practically the only one. (Pointing to
Prema-prayojana dasa) He is the black sheep of my sannyasis.
[Sripad Madhava Maharaja:] But he is not against bhakti. He is not against
devotee and devotion. He is in line. .
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] I appreciate him, because although he
has somewhat gone down, he is very strong in siddhanta and is always
following me wherever I go. Whereas in ISKCON, so many sannyasis gave up
the path of pure bhakti. I hope he will soon come back [to sannyasa, and
be wholly mine].
[Prema-prayojana dasa:] I am here.
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] Have you no shame? Are you not ashamed?
[Brajanath dasa:] Now more Gurukulis have arrived.
(To Gurukulis) You should deeply think about whether you want money or
pure bhakti. If you want pure bhakti, then attend my classes at any cost.
[Devotee:] We are so young, and there are so many things in the world that
pull us. Maya is very strong. What is your advice for us to keep strong
and develop in bhakti?
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] If there is a strong rain-shower, you
can be protected by a big umbrella. Do you understand? Similarly, if you
take shelter of a pure Vaisnava, then you can very easily be protected
from maya.
Anything more?
[Devotee:] Gurudeva, what will happen if there is no association where we
live?
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] Without good association you will not
attain pure bhakti. You can chant the holy name, but it is very difficult
to chant properly without good association.
[Devotee:] What should we do if we are not in good association?
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] You should all come under the umbrella
of a powerful Vaisnava at once.
You should know that all of my Western sannyasis and thousands of my
brahmacaris are from ISKCON, having lived there for twenty-five, twenty,
ten, or five years. They became so much attracted by hearing my classes
that they came to me and joined.
[Devotee:] Yesterday I had a dream, and you were in it. I was very scared
in that dream, and I woke up with that feeling of fear in my heart. I want
to ask if being scared is a normal feeling? I was scared because all my
close, intimate friends, and the people who I really, really care about
and who are important in my life, are in ISKCON. I am afraid that once I
accept your lotus feet, I will be very much discriminated against by them.
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] In your childhood and when you became
more grown up, did you not have a deep connection with your father, mother,
sister, and other relatives?
[Devotee:] Yes
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] And now you have even more of a
relation with the ISKCON leaders and other devotees. Do you understand?
Similarly, you can again give up your present relationships for better
ones by coming to me. Everyone wants success in their life, and the most
successful thing is pure bhakti. If you want bhakti, especially pure
bhakti, then come to me.
Do you know the definition of bhakti? I know that you cannot explain it:
anyabhilasita sunyam
jnana karmadi anavritam
anukulyena krsnanusilanam
bhaktir uttama
["The cultivation of activities that are meant exclusively for the
pleasure of Sri Krsna, or in other words the uninterrupted flow of service
to Sri Krsna, performed through all endeavours of the body, mind and
speech, and through the expression of various spiritual sentiments (bhavas),
which is not covered by jnana (knowledge aimed at impersonal liberation)
and karma (reward-seeking activity), and which is devoid of all desires
other than the aspiration to bring happiness to Sri Krsna, is called
uttama-bhakti, pure devotional service." (Sri Bhakti-rasamrta-sindhu
1.1.11)]
Can you bravely come to my evening class? All of you?
[Devotees:] Yes.
[Brajanath dasa:] They have all been coming, every day.
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] Come to my class this evening, and
there we will define pure bhakti. In pure bhakti there is no anyabhilasa,
no desires other than the desire to please Krsna. (To Prema-prayojana dasa)
Please explain this verse in brief.
[Prema-prayojana dasa:] Srila Gurudeva is saying that it is important to
understand the definition of pure bhakti. In brief, the meaning of the
verse is this: Pure bhakti is the continuous, unbroken cultivation of all
activities of the body, mind, words, and spiritual feelings which are
meant exclusively for the benefit of Sri Krsna, which are completely free
from all other desires, and which is not covered by karma (fruitive
activities), jnana (knowledge to get liberation), yoga, and other things.
[Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja:] Almost all the ISKCON leaders are
anyabhilasita, which means that they have desires other than the desire
for bhakti. They want money – and also bhakti. Their status may be called
bhakti, but it is “adhama-bhakti,” meaning the lowest class of bhakti. I
request you all; don’t lose your valuable time. Try to achieve pure bhakti.
Thank you all.
Gaura-premanandi.
[*Endnote – Sastra forbids a sannyasi (one in the renounced order of life)
to again become a householder. Still, the editors of this harikatha
article had reservations about publishing this section of the darsana.
They expressed their concerns to Srila Narayana Gosvami Maharaja, who
replied, "Why should you publish my words only when I give praise? My
entire talk with Prema-prayojana must be given in print. I have chastised
him. A guru has the power to chastise, and others will learn if it is
given in print.]
Lealdade é a chave para o sucesso espiritual
Gurudev´s darshan com devotos que estão ou já estiveram na iskcon
Brasil – 2010
Gurudeva S.N.M : Eles não podem te dar bhakti pura, como nós estamos dando. Alguém tem alguma pergunta?
Devota: Nós devemos sempre respeitar nossos parentes, então qual deve ser nossa atitude com nossos parentes quando eles não são favoráveis a você e até mesmo ofendem?
Gurudeva : Você conhece Prahlada Maharaj? Ele sempre tolerou seu pai, mesmo que seu pai quisesse te matar, Prahlada Maharaj sempre tolerou, mas Prahlada era muito forte. Você deve ser igual Prahlada, forte em bhakti, e esperar ver se as coisas mudam.
Devoto: Muito destes garotos aqui, nasceram e cresceram em Nova Gokula (Iskcon), hoje o lugar está muito vazio, todos devotos que vivem lá, não tem gosto em praticar bhakti, e todos eles estão contra você, mas sempre quando retornamos para lá, nos sentimos em casa. Então, o que devemos fazer para ajudar este lugar?
Gurudeva: Dois ou três livros foram publicados, minha relação com meu siksha guru (Siksha Guru and priya bandhu), Cartas da América etc..., vocês devem ler estes lvros, na verdade eles não tem respeito por Swamiji como eu, a maneira que eu o glorifico, eles não podem fazer. Eles não podem nem dar a definição de o que é bhakti. Até mesmo vocês, vocês estiveram por lá muitos anos, alguém pode me falar o que é bhakti? Eu sei que vocês não podem, Alguém aqui pode? Se vocês querem dinheiro, vocês devem ir á Iskcon, mas se vocês querem bhakti, então vocês devem vir á mim. Vou contar á vocês uma coisa. Mais ou menos um mês atrás, o principal líder da iskcon e mais quatro ou cinco representantes (G.B.C), vieram até mim e disseram: “ Sabemos que fizemos muitas coisas erradas contra você, por favor desculpe-nos, por favor desculpe-nos. Queremos nos relacionar com você como era antes.” Eu disse á eles: “Vocês devem deixar eu ir ao templo de vocês falar hari-katha, e vocês também devem vir até mim, escutar nossas aulas nos nossos templos, como era antes. Vocês sabem que Swami Maharaj tomou sanyassi na nossa Keshavji Gaudiya Math em Mathura, que eu o ensinei a usar sua danda, sua kaupin e tudo mais? Eu me associei com ele desde 1946. Vocês devem saber que todos estes sanyassis da Iskcon, mais de 90 por cento, se tornaram grhastas, ficaram contra a iskcon, pegaram muito muito dinheiro e foram embora, mas meus discípulos, muito raro, apenas um sanyassi meu largou sanyassa, apenas um, mas eles foram mais de 95 por cento, mesmo este sanyassi, ele não largou bhakti, mesmo assim ele está sempre comigo, praticando etc.. mesmo que ele caiu, ainda sim ele e muito forte em siddhanta, sempre seguindo muito estritamente Mas Brahmananda, Bhavananda, Bhagavan das etc.. largaram tudo. Vocês devem pensar profundamente, se vocês querem dinheiro, ou bhakti pura, se querem bhakti pura devem escutar minhas aulas a todo custo.
Devoto: Somos tão jovens, e neste mundo há tantas coisas ilusórias que é muito difícil praticar bhakti, como podemos desapegar-mos da influência de maya neste mundo e praticar bhakti?
Gurudeva: Se vem uma chuva muito forte, mas você se refugia em um guarda chuva, você não sentirá os efeitos dela. Assim também, se vocês se abrigam em um devoto puro, maya não irá atrapalhar vocês. Alguma coisa mais?
Devoto: Não há boa associação onde moramos, o que devemos fazer?
Gurudeva: Vocês estão cantando os santos nomes, mas o que é o nome puro? Vai ser muito difícil para vocês. Vocês devem ficar sobre o guarda chuva de qualquer vaishnava puro. Vocês também devem saber que todos os meus sanyassis e também vários brahmacaris, todos passaram pela iskcon por 5, 10, 15 ou 20 anos, e agora eles escutam minhas aulas e estão muito fortes.
Devoto: Eu estou com muito medo, que se eu me render a você, todos os meu parentes e amigos, que são todos da iskcon, vão me discriminar.
Gurudeva: Qual é a sua relação com seus pais hoje? Qual é a relação dos líderes da iskcon agora? Então, você deve larga-los também e vir até mim. Se você quer bhakti, especialmente bhakti pura, você sabe o que é bhakti pura? “Não”. Eu sei que você não sabe. Vocês podem vir ás minhas aulas? Vocês devem vir. Não deve existir outros desejos á não ser bhakti. Os líderes da iskcon, todos querem dinheiro, e as vezes bhakti, mas qual bhakti? Adhama bhakti, bhakti baixa, então peço a vocês, não percam seu tempo e tentem conseguir bhakti pura.
20100115_SAOPAULO_AM_ENGPORT_DARSHAN.WAV link para escutar em som]
tradução Prabhu Baladeva
AS TRÊS GRANDES ONDAS DE SRI CAITANYA MAHAPRABHU NO BRASIL
(História do Movimento Hare Krsna no Brasil - por Vyasa Dasa)
Relato Histórico do Inicio do Vaisnavismo no Brasil em 1973, com A.C. Bhaktivendanta Swami Prabhupada, e os demais momentos importantes que se seguiram com a continuidade evolutiva do Estabelecimento de Grandes Acaryas Vaisnavas, sendo Srila Sridhara Maharaja a partir de 1.980 e atualmente Srila Narayana Maharaja.
Estamos no Ar desde 20 de janeiro de 2.003Você é o nosso visitante nº
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